The blasphemy law has now been passed in the Dail, as part of Defamation Act, with no debate on the blasphemy amendments. The debate was restricted to an hour (for the full Defamation Bill). Justice Minister Dermot Ahern said that extending time for the blasphemy amendments would just be regurgitating what has been discussed ad nauseum. There was an average of six TDs in the Dail during debate.
The law now only has to pass through Seanad before being signed into law by President. It is scheduled for 10.30 am tomorrow morning in the Seanad. The Atheist Ireland AGM will plan a response to this blasphemy law, between 2-5pm this Saturday in Wynns Hotel Dublin. Members of the public are welcome to attend. Please attend, and also invite anyone you think might be interested in campaigning for an ethical and secular Ireland.
Lets “pray” David Norris pulls through for us
Comment by Stiofán — July 8, 2009 @ 4:09 pm
I’ll be there and so will my camcorder.
If they think passing this will stop blasphemy or a mass blasphemy is protest, then they are dead wrong.
- Paul M.
Comment by Paul Markey — July 9, 2009 @ 1:23 am
Heading back to the dark ages….way to go Ireland
Comment by furball — July 9, 2009 @ 4:08 am
So much for Freedom of Speech.
Comment by Lurker — July 9, 2009 @ 5:20 am
[...] Bill, 2006 – including the definition and new penalties for blasphemous libel – was passed by the Dail yesterday. It only needs to pass the Seanad today and it will be [...]
Pingback by Ireland makes brave step backward to the 14th century « The Clockwork Chartophylax — July 9, 2009 @ 8:57 am
Wow,the Irish are morons aren’t they… stupidest thing ever… wow… wow… wow… I can’t believe it.. who was drinking to much on this one… We’ll be making fun of the Irish for centuries if this goes through
Comment by tib — July 9, 2009 @ 10:00 am
Fuck Jesus Fuck God Fuck Mary Fuck Joeseph Fuck Jehovan Fuck Allah Fuck Buddah. Jesus Fucked Mary In The Ass While God Gave Joeseph a Handjob and St. Peter was Felching The Holy Spirits Mucky Catholic Dirtbox. God is a motherfucking bastard fucker cuntface with a whore for a mother and an S&M slut for a son.
Comment by The Antichrist — July 9, 2009 @ 10:39 am
Unbelievable, back to the dark ages and another incompetent performance by members of the Dail.
Comment by Rene Borg — July 9, 2009 @ 10:44 am
I propose setting up a website where people are encouraged to post blasphemous comments so as to try to get as many prosecutions as possible out of this ridiculous law.
Comment by Eamonn — July 9, 2009 @ 11:12 am
@tib – i don’t believe in trolls either
Comment by demotic — July 9, 2009 @ 11:12 am
this has been posted on reddit
http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/8zgu9/a_sad_day_for_freedom_of_speech_ireland_passes/
Comment by sharkey — July 9, 2009 @ 12:03 pm
Im gonna quote something than il comment on it
Aisha was initially betrothed to Jubayr ibn Mut’im, a Muslim whose father, though pagan, was friendly to the Muslims. When Khawla bint Hakim suggested that Muhammad marry Aisha after the death of Muhammad’s first wife (Khadijah bint Khuwaylid), the previous agreement regarding marriage of Aisha with ibn Mut’im was put aside by common consent.[1] British historian William Montgomery Watt suggests that Muhammad hoped to strengthen his ties with Abu Bakr;[1] the strengthening of ties commonly served as a basis for marriage in Arabian culture.[2]
According to the traditional sources, Aisha was six or seven years old when betrothed to Muhammad.[1][3][4] American historian Denise Spellberg states that “these specific references to the bride’s age reinforce Aisha’s pre-menarcheal status and, implicitly, her virginity.”[3] This issue of her virginity was of great importance to early historians who supported the Abbasid Caliphate. These historians considered that as Muhammad’s only virgin wife, Aisha was divinely intended for him, and therefore the most credible regarding the debate over the succession to Muhammad.[3]
Aisha stayed in her parents’ home for several years until she joined Muhammad and the marriage was consummated.[1][3][4][5][6][7] Most of the sources indicate that she was nine years old at the time
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aisha#Marriage_to_Muhammad
The Alleged figure Muhammed
And i say alleged because I dont beleive in any such alleged figures such as the toothfairy,The Boogeyman and i dont the believe in the alleged figure muhammed
but the alleged figure muhammed was a bloody fucking pedofile
Comment by Talia — July 9, 2009 @ 12:08 pm
OPEN LETTER TO ATHEIST IRELAND
Recent disclosures indicate that Atheist Ireland will issue a statement blaspheming all religions in Ireland in opposition to the Blasphemy bill that has been passed by the Dail. What is to be gained by such an action? If the contention is with Minister Ahern, then why deliberately make enemies of and distance those who currently have no issues with your right to choose disbelief?
As a significant minority living in Ireland, Muslims abide by the principles in both the Quran and Sunnah that lay the groundwork for peaceful cohabitation and cooperation, premised upon mutual respect and civility. Why would Atheist Ireland actively seek to break this covenant?
With a renewed religious fervour in Ireland offering some solace to the weary in these difficult times, why would Atheist Ireland actively seek to belittle such conviction? For many the emptiness of atheism offers no hope, hope in difficult times maintains balance – why would Atheist Ireland seek to unhinge that delicate poise and cast society into the disarray of hopelessness?
As there is a law that currently prohibits such statements and a new proposed law that will enforce that prohibition, why would Atheist Ireland with criminal intention, openly seek to break the law? What signals does this send, especially in a time of economic turmoil? If a law can so easily be cast aside because it does not suit, should we all pick and choose our own? This is a dangerous precedent being proffered in retaliation for a law that for all intents and purposes is not going to make much difference in the day-to-day aspects of our lives.
We humbly ask Atheist Ireland to reconsider their potentially disastrous proposal. Your right to grossly insult people does not trump society’s right to live in peace and mutual harmony.
http://www.mpac.ie/content/view/358/1/
Comment by MPACIE — July 9, 2009 @ 3:13 pm
To the above; fuck off. If the wizard in the sky has a problem with me insulting his Zombie kid, he can take it up with me when I’m dead.
Comment by Agnostic — July 9, 2009 @ 3:45 pm
To Mpac that sounds a bit rich coming from an ideology
That practices Female genital Mutilation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsqEyGdLh8I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ayD4sfSm2Y
That practices Honour Killings
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuVwgconEMI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujqmv-VPN6I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SyU3jlQ_jI&feature=related
that violently oppresses women
http://www.terrorismawareness.org/videos/108/the-violent-oppression-of-wome=%20n-in-islam/
that gave us 9,11
il show certain quotes and certain verses which would of inspired
the very same quotes of what those involved in 911 said
Remember the 2001 OBL tape?
Heres somes quotes from that video
Quote:
Shaykh: At the exact time of the attack on America, precisely at the time. He (Bahrani) gave a very impressive sermon. Thanks be to Allah for his blessings. He (Bahrani) was the first one to write at war time. I visited him twice in Al-Qasim.
UBL: Thanks be to Allah
Quote:
‘Ulwan) said this was jihad and those people were not innocent people (World Trade Center and Pentagon victims). He swore to Allah. This was transmitted to Shaykh Sulayman Al ((‘Umar)) Allah bless him
.
Quote:
I was ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah, and his prophet Muhammad.”
Quote:
At the end of the newscast, they reported that a plane just hit the World Trade Center.
Shaykh: Allah be praised
heres the Transcript of that video
il show certain quotes and certain verses which would of inspired
the very same quotes of what those involved in 911 said
Remember the 2001 OBL tape?
Heres somes quotes from that video
Quote:
Shaykh: At the exact time of the attack on America, precisely at the time. He (Bahrani) gave a very impressive sermon. Thanks be to Allah for his blessings. He (Bahrani) was the first one to write at war time. I visited him twice in Al-Qasim.
UBL: Thanks be to Allah
Quote:
‘Ulwan) said this was jihad and those people were not innocent people (World Trade Center and Pentagon victims). He swore to Allah. This was transmitted to Shaykh Sulayman Al ((‘Umar)) Allah bless him
.
Quote:
I was ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah, and his prophet Muhammad.”
Quote:
At the end of the newscast, they reported that a plane just hit the World Trade Center.
Shaykh: Allah be praised
heres the Transcript of that video
http://edition.cnn.com/2001/US/12/13/tape.transcript/
and heres the video itself
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0FVeqCX6z8
Now Il break down a quote from that video
Quote:
I was ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah, and his prophet Muhammad
And now Il refer to some Qur’an verses which would of inspired him to make that very comment
Quote:
Qur’an (3:56) – “As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help
Quote:
Qur’an (3:151) – “Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority”.
Quote:
Qur’an (8:12) – “I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them” No reasonable person would interpret this to mean a spiritual struggle
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Quran/023-violence.htm
Now Il refer to
Hijacker Mohamed Atta’s Suicide Note: Part One
some quotes
Quote:
After you recite you will see things get easier without your intervention because God had promised his servants who recite this invocations with the following: 1- [Victory] with the grace of His blessings. 2- They were not harmed. 3- Follow God’s [illegible]. God said
http://abcnews.go.com/International/Story?id=79168&page=3
Quote:
Pray for yourself and your brothers that God grants victory, ask Him to grant you martyrdom
http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=79167&page=1
Quote:
If God grant you [the honor of] slaughtering [the enemy] wish its reward [the actual slaughter] to be granted to your father and your mother, they have rights over you. Do not disagree, obey. If you slaughter, you should [illegible] this is a tradition of the Prophet, peace be upon him, but according to the rules
http://abcnews.go.com/International/Story?id=79167&page=2
Again Il refer to the verses i posted above which would of inspired Mohamed Atta
Comment by Talia — July 9, 2009 @ 4:07 pm
To whoever commented #13
Seriously, you do not get the point to this.
The new blasphemy law, should it pass means that any religious group can be taken up for blasphemy, not just non-believers.
Since all religious factions naturally blaspheme against each other as “their way is correct and the rest are wrong”. They not only believe this but also take offence if you state otherwise.
It is not just us getting aggrivated about this, as it effectively is a breach of human rights as well as free speech. To try and censor or limit the public or press communications, in any way, is deplorable. To try and then push a fine or punishment for doing so is even worse.
Quote -
” We humbly ask Atheist Ireland to reconsider their potentially disastrous proposal. Your right to grossly insult people does not trump society’s right to live in peace and mutual harmony”
You do realise that all religions naturally blaspheme each other, right? oh wait, no you don’t.
How about our rights? has that even come into your head?
The fact that non-believers will not be able to question other people on certain areas is a denial or rights. We do not aim to “grossly insult people”, that is an assertion by you, who obviously has no idea what we and other Atheists and Agnostics are about. How about researching things before you try and comment on them?
What about our right to live in peace and mutual harmony and question other peoples beliefs like they rightly should be questioned? We do not mind people questioning our position on the subject, so why should religious factions be immune from questioning?
Oh yea, thats right, because we are not a part of your group…
Comment by Paul Markey — July 9, 2009 @ 5:19 pm
——————————————————————————–
Just to add as well as to what bringing in blasphemy may encourage here
with this recent case in Kasur
Quote:
At least 110 Christian families, almost 700 people, were forced on Tuesday night to flee Bahmniwala, a village in Kasur, after angry mobs attacked and threatened to burn their houses for allegedly committing blasphemy
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=200972\story_2-7-2009_pg7_4
Comment by Talia — July 9, 2009 @ 5:25 pm
What a fucking load of cum.
If I want to call your invisible man a cunt I will.
Allah can suck Jesus’s cock while mohammed, Buddha, Krishna and moses Rim a goat.
On a serious note this has to be one of the biggest backward steps in any western country for some time. Bad play Ireland, bad play.
Comment by Marc — July 9, 2009 @ 6:06 pm
13# – Do you seriously think you are actually protected under this?? Do you think you could get a conviction out of it??? Seriously.
If Atheist Ireland post a statement, it won’t be to offend religion, it will be to a) Show how ridiculous this legislation is
b) Show how crap the government is coming out with these mickey mouse laws
If someone’s feelings get hurt in the process thats tough-titty
Do you know the amount of loopholes in Irish law, do you know people get off convictions if the arresting garda is on holidays when court is announced??
Grow the fuck up, and go to an English class, My dog would articulate himself better than that tripe you just posted. You might want to read this law; VERY carefully.
The only thing that will change is we will have another stupid law to add to our already flawed legal system.
Comment by Stiof — July 9, 2009 @ 9:21 pm
Stiof: If you don’t believe that it affords any protection then we can only conclude that you wish to be deliberately antagonistic and verbally violent. In effect you are saying that it isn’t about the bill at all, it’s simply to insult religious adherents. Glad you have made yourself clear.
PS. You might consider taking articulation tips from your dog, foul language is always the recourse of the fool.
Comment by Mujaahid — July 9, 2009 @ 10:24 pm
The legal concept of blasphemy is as dumb as the idea of the virgin Mary in a feckin tree stump!!! As if even the concept of the virgin Mary wasnt silly enough that she would seek refuge in a tree stump. I thought it was illegal to take LSD obviously the catholic church have a big stash hid away and the priests are partying hard. Yes Ireland is fast heading back to the 80s.
Comment by Cyril — July 9, 2009 @ 10:29 pm
@19:
Read between the lines of #13:
paraphrased: “you’ll interfere with ’social peace’ if people insult our religion” – i.e. “question/insult our religion and we will kill you – and others – and it will be your fault because you know we get violent when you question/insult our beliefs”
standard Islamic interaction with Western culture – get used to it, it is a growing problem.
Comment by JM — July 10, 2009 @ 7:45 am
@13:
“As a significant minority living in Ireland, Muslims abide by the principles in both the Quran and Sunnah that lay the groundwork for peaceful cohabitation and cooperation, premised upon mutual respect and civility. Why would Atheist Ireland actively seek to break this covenant?”
We Satanists follow the the principle that each group should be freely allowed to practice their religion. My religion involves blaspheming against your gods. This principle premised on the freedom to practice one’s religion lays the groundwork for peaceful cohabitation and cooperation with your religious minority – why do you wish to break this covenant?
And by the way – Muhammad was an atheist. Read Ibn Ishaq’s Sirat Rasul Allah (especially the bits about Ibn Said) closely…
Comment by JM — July 10, 2009 @ 8:04 am
If this becomes a reality I propose a public black mass, to the music of “Pure Fucking Armageddon”, the government cannot fine us if there is enough people.
Comment by Dacid Bourke — July 10, 2009 @ 11:46 am
Wow… seems like Ireland is fast becoming a western N.Korea.
Comment by Skeptici — July 10, 2009 @ 12:41 pm
lengthy blog post over here about this
http://ladyboyjesus.com/commentary/blasphemy-is-a-crime-in-ireland/
from the “motivational” graphic at the top:
Blasphemy:
The belief that a cosmic Jewish zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.
Comment by church of dermotology — July 10, 2009 @ 1:01 pm
So i assume it made it through the Seanad?
Comment by Paddy — July 10, 2009 @ 1:03 pm
paddy -> yes it has
read more here:
http://chartophylax.kaybensoft.com/?p=2101
deciding vote was by an FFer and Deirdre De Burca of the Greens.
yes – the Greens. you couldnt make it up.
Comment by church of dermotology — July 10, 2009 @ 1:43 pm
Blasphemy is one thing, outright sexual profanity is quite another and does not further the argument against this ridiculous law by a single page. I challenge any of you to come up with a series of blasphemous statements that do not involve any form of sexual profanity.
Remember we are Irish, so show some true wit, not this trash.
“Blasphemy, blas for you, blas for everyone!” ~ Eddie Izzard on Blasphemy
Comment by Badger — July 10, 2009 @ 4:52 pm
I would sincerely like to appologise for my somewhat inflammatory comments directed at the gentleman who posted on behalf of MPAC (#13). I was out on the sauce and was a bit steamed up. Thats no reason for Mujaadid to get upset on someone else’s behalf – chill out, I was only winding to poor fella up, besides, I’m sure he can fight his own battles.
I don’t understand why people are getting their knickers in a twist over something like taking the piss out of religion. It’s like farting in bed and shoving your missus’ head under the duvet – just a bit of craic, no malice intended.
Comment by Stiof — July 10, 2009 @ 5:37 pm
“With the first link the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably.” – Judge Aaron Satie
(Granted it’s a fictional quote, but that doesn’t make it any less true)
Comment by Coyote Trax — July 10, 2009 @ 9:16 pm
We don’t need the profaity of the hate. But when a clearly inspired religious law tries to make free speech a crime then it is time to break the law on a point of principle.
What about trying to bring free speach back from the dead in 3 days?
Or crucifying free speech in the Phoenix Park on the papal cross before Mary Mac signs the bill into law?
Or the agnostic dislexic – he didn’t know whether he should believe in a dog or not? (apologies to dislexics (I’m sure that’s not how you spell it!)
Comment by Stephen MacNally — July 10, 2009 @ 9:23 pm
Another erosion of personal freedom comes into effect. In a way i feel partly culpable for abiding by a system whereby fools in suits decree what is in my best interests. Surely most decent people have the wit and self determination to distinguish between heated debate and outright abuse for themselves without being told what to think by graceless buffoons with the intellectual capacity of a burst radiator. Slow restrictive change has facilitated the growth of abominable political groups in the past, i hope it won’t again…
Comment by brian e — July 10, 2009 @ 9:29 pm
In a reply to one commenter on the Irish Time’s site, Mr Nugent states: “I am for an ethical and secular Ireland, where people are free to live happy and free and fulfilling lives, gradually learn more during every generation about how the universe works, and live together in a just society based on empathy for all other sentient beings”. To bring about this ‘ethical’, ‘happy’, and ‘just’ society his organisation intends to begin by grossly insulting ALL religious adherents this coming Saturday. It seems to us that his vision of a future Ireland looks decidedly unhappy for people of religious persuasion.
http://www.mpac.ie/content/view/360/1/
Comment by Truth.ie — July 10, 2009 @ 10:17 pm
Blasphemy? Arse!!
Comment by Father Jack Hackett — July 11, 2009 @ 2:06 pm
Hi is gonna be a transcript of the mmeting or a video of it put up on youtube?
Comment by Talia — July 11, 2009 @ 4:31 pm
Quote by Badger -I challenge any of you to come up with a series of blasphemous statements that do not involve any form of sexual profanity.
No problem Badger, here goes-
There is no god.
Jesus was not only not god, not god’s son or god’s brothrer, or related to the holy ghost, but from all accounts (all of which are unreliable), a bronze age shyster.
The Catholic Church in Ireland continues to spread lies even today.
Adan and Eve’s immediate children must have had sex with their brothers and sisters.
Mohommad was a paedophile, having raped a nine year old child, if evidence recorded the well known work of fantasy known as Koran is to be believed.
If you believe that Moh flew to heven riding on a horse with the face of a woman to receive the Koran (or parts thereof) from god, your are an Idiot.
If God requires that part of your penis be cut off he is evil
Only someone or something with a sick mind would cure leper of his terrible disease to get attention while all along permitting the disease to flourish, having thought of it and released it on mankind.
There is no god but Allah -blasphemous to all others than Muslims
The holy Trinity is god -blasphemous to all others than some Christians
There is no god -blasphemous to all theists
Need I go on?
Comment by Jack Butler — July 11, 2009 @ 6:07 pm
Another way to test this law
we could invite Ayaan Hirsi Ali to Ireland to give a lecture of her own experience as ex muslim,
What would happen ,Would Ireland be the first and only country in The EU to ban Ayaan Hirsi Ali from entering?
Comment by Talia — July 12, 2009 @ 1:56 am
Anyone could have seen this coming.
In all of Europe, the place that has the littlest genetic matter from beautiful inland peoples, particularly the proto-indo-european people and to a lesser extent the proto-uralic people, is Ireland. Only during the celtic migration did some of the PIEs enter the island, settling mainly in the eastern part. The indigenous inhabitants of Ireland are, for the most part, vulgar-looking and have theocratic temperament, theocracy being a vulgar ideal. Ireland was therefore predisposed to theocracy from the start.
In more recent years, theocrats in many places have taken to breeding at a high rate, whereas comparatively rational people have been more negligent to breeding than they were in the past. This is true not only of Ireland, but of pretty much all places in the world at the current time.
It was therefore only a matter of time in Ireland before the fanatics’ evil seed reached voting age and put their own kind into the majority of legislative seats. Ireland is just the beginning. This will happen in other jurisdictions as well if the secularists continue to make so few offspring.
Comment by V — July 12, 2009 @ 5:25 am
MPACIE @ #13 said
a. This sounds like a threat of violence (and, in Ireland, we know how this kind of threat works, as similar language is commonly used in what passes for political discourse in the North of Ireland).
b. The “breaker” of peace and mutual harmony is anyone who threatens, assaults, harms, kills the body of another human being. Speech, no matter what the content, does not do this. The speech of another cannot ever justify a threat, an assault, a harm or a killing of another human being.
c. I, therefore insist on my right to be grossly insulted, offended or otherwise verbally excoriated, if necesary to defend free speech, which will never hurt my body. Equally, I insist on my right to go about my business in peace, and to fear noone for expressing my thoughts, whatever they are.
Comment by Yer Wan — July 12, 2009 @ 9:12 am
Yer Wan: (a) Your sort see a threat of violence in passing wind, cop on to yourself.
(b) as is the one who brings about that break in peace and harmony whether it be through verbal or physical violence. As for the latter part of your ridiculous tirade, go read up on the law and see whether unfettered speech can be justifiably threatened.
(c) You don’t have that right and if you think you do I challenge you to stand outside the main Garda office and use your so-called freedom to disparage Jews, homosexuals, women, etc. Don’t bother replying to this post until you have done that otherwise you are simply a bag of hot wind that should duly be ignored.
Comment by Truthseeker — July 12, 2009 @ 3:05 pm
In reply to post 41
Belief = Opinion one holds. Labelling it as Belief doesn’t change the fact that you are looking for a certain point of view to be exempted from ridicule
I read a certain comment on the mpac page
quote
An insult against religion IS an insult against its adherents,
http://www.mpac.ie/content/view/360/1/#jreactions
Wrong it isnt,
Il point out how many things thats akin to arguing
to argue that
is akin to arguing criticism on socialism or communism is an insult to all socialists and communists
Its akin to arguing criticism of capitalism is an insult to all capitalists
Its akin to arguing people who leave scientology and writes books about escaping scientology is an insult to all scientologists
http://www.amazon.com/Escaping-Scientology-Insiders-True-Story/dp/1596690666/ref=sr_1_34?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1247414746&sr=1-34
Its akin to arguing criticism of Satanism is an insult to all satanists
Its akin to arguing criticism of paganism is an insult to all pagans
its akin to arguing criticism of Witchcraft is an insult to all Wiccans
Its akin to arguing criticism of Falun Gong is an insult to all Falun Gong Practioners
Its akin to arguing criticism of a certain film is an insult to all the actors in the film
its akin to arguing criticism of a political party is an insult to all the members of that political party
Comment by Talia — July 12, 2009 @ 4:14 pm
Do you think the blasphemy law is against all who blaspheme or just blasphemy Talia?
Comment by Truthseeker — July 12, 2009 @ 5:14 pm
I wrote the following letter to the Irish Times on Satyrday evening last. Wonder if they’ll print it?
Madam,
I recently attended a function in St. Mary’s Rugby Club in Limerick.
At the time it struck me as somewhat odd that a rugby club or team should be called after the holy mother. However all was explained recently by reports from Rathkeale -it seems she was built like a tree stump.
On a more serious note though, Could uttering this little piece of humour cause me (or you, should you have the guts to print it) to be convicted of blasphemy in the near future?
Sincerely,
Jack Butler
Comment by Jack Butler — July 13, 2009 @ 12:38 pm
“Religion doesn’t have a prayer”
Comment by Rob Heffernan — July 13, 2009 @ 1:02 pm
Truthseeker wrote:
“I challenge you to stand outside the main Garda office and use your so-called freedom to disparage Jews, homosexuals, women, etc.”
There’s quite enough of that already happening in countries where Islam is the predominant religion. We’d rather not have any more of that here. Anyone wanting Islam to be protected from insult should consider relocating to one of those countries.
Would you say that insulting astrology is an insult to astrologers? How about homeopathy or communism? Should all ideas be protected so long as people claim them to be religions. Well, I had another divine revelation from Mohammed, and he told me that blasphemy is a requirement for entering heaven. So what should the law protect? My beliefs or those of muslims?
Truthseeker wrote:
“Do you think the blasphemy law is against all who blaspheme or just blasphemy Talia?”
What do you mean by “against”? If I understand your question, the answer is blasphemy. The law does not prohibit blasphemers. The two are separate, just like people and their beliefs.
Comment by Sean — July 13, 2009 @ 3:00 pm
what is your concept of blasphemy ?
As your concept is different will be different to be the majority non muslim population
and the concept of the majority living here who are non muslim view it as a victimless crime
as one persons religion is another persons blasphemy
this book here
http://www.amazon.com/Islam-True-Faith-Religion-Humanity/dp/B0029J4YF2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1247498276&sr=1-1
could be defined as blasphemy because its claiming to be the one true faith
Since you re the only one on this site who believes in the concept of blasphemy
woudd you be in favour of banning that particular book
After all people of other faiths might view it as of blasphemy
Il go into more one persons religion is another persons blasphemy
this site here says
Quote:
1. Is wicca compatible with Christianity?
No, the bible forbids the practice of witchcraft:
“there shall not be found among you anyone who…practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, or one who conjures up spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead. For all these things are abomination to the lord… ” Deuteronomy 18:10-12
http://www.angelfire.com/mo/cultwatch/indexw.html
since that verse defines Wicca as blasphemy
Should the state step in as stop all practice of Wicca because
the bible forbids Wicca?
after all Christians view Wicca as blasphemy
But if they do that it will contradict the right to religious belief
or what about the popes comments on paganism
Quote:
PARIS – Pope Benedict XVI condemned unbridled “pagan” passion for power
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26677884
Should the pope be banned from entering Ireland if some pagans may view his comment as blasphemy towards them
Il turn to the satanic bible and the christian bible
from the satanic bible
Quote:
The Book of Lucifer: The Enlightenment
The Book of Lucifer: The Enlightenment directly follows The Book of Satan. After the indignant intonation of The Book of Satan, The Book of Lucifer seeks to logically expound the philosophy and dogma of Satanism. The Book of Lucifer is divided into twelve essays, each of them a vital component of LaVey’s architecture of Satanism. The following are brief synopses of each of these essays:
I. – Wanted! – God – Dead or Alive
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Satanic_Bible
Quote:
9. Satan has been the best friend the Church has ever had, as He has kept it in business all these years!
http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/NineStatements.html
from the christian bible
Quote:
When we are baptized, we reject Satan, all His works, and all His empty promises because we believe in God the Father, and God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. By renewing and living our Baptisms, we sense the Holy Spirit crying out in our hearts “Abba” (“Father”) (see Gal 4:6
http://www.answers2prayer.org/bible_questions/Answers/baptism/saved.html
now both those religions if one belives in the concept of blasephmey becasue both blasephmes against the other
Il turn to cows and Hindus
in India, the cow is believed to be a symbol of the earth – because it gives so much yet asks nothing in return. They are guileless in their behavior and from them flow sacrifices… and milk and curds and butter. It acts as a surrogate mother by providing milk to human beings for the whole life.
http://hinduism.about.com/b/2009/04/27/why-is-the-cow-sacred-to-hindus-2.htm
if one belives in the concept of blasephmey everyone who eats beef
blasephmes against Hindus
Comment by Talia — July 13, 2009 @ 3:23 pm
@ Talia Re: Mohhamed “He’s not the son of God he’s a very naughty boy!”
Comment by gulag — July 13, 2009 @ 3:30 pm
Comment by Truth.ie — July 10, 2009 @ 10:17 pm
go away you blasphemer, with your false god Mohammed , Allah or whatever it is..
Come to the ice cream wafers and worship the one true light of the world – Dermot Ahern
Church of Dermotology:
http://www.dermotology.ie
Comment by church of dermotology — July 13, 2009 @ 5:03 pm
“Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear”
Thomas Jefferson
always a good quote – and despite the urban legend of him being atheist, Jefferson was actually a Deist.
i like the quote , because rather than attacking atheists or attacking deists, it stands above that and appeals to reason in all of mankind.
Comment by justinf — July 13, 2009 @ 5:19 pm
Whatever one might think of the Blasphemy law, the apocalyptic clamouring of Atheist Ireland coupled with hyperbolic portents of a return to the Middle Ages has all the makings of a good joke, if it weren’t so obviously disingenuous. For while Atheist Ireland may indeed speak of ‘an ethical and secular Ireland, where people are free to live happy and free and fulfilling lives’ their first act after the Blasphemy bill was passed was to convene a meeting with the stated aim of grossly insulting ALL religions in Ireland. Atheist Ireland’s vision of a future Ireland looks decidedly bleak for all religious adherents. Indeed a glance at their affiliate website Blasphemy.ie should give all followers of religion a good idea of the kind of Ireland envisioned by this group.
Despite claims to the contrary, religious adherents are not asking for any preferential treatment. We merely seek the same as those enjoyed by the rest of society – the right not to be harmed. It is acknowledged that the free dissemination of ideas representing certain communities as inferior or open to gross offence and ridicule can create a social climate that is conducive to the spread of xenophobia and racism; to combat this we have laws that protect groups and communities in society. Why should it be any different for religious communities? Are they not as susceptible and at risk of feeling disadvantaged by the propagation of speech that constantly denigrates their deeply held beliefs and convictions? What about the self-worth of a religious adherent in a climate of violent and hostile speech? How would such open hostility impact on their prospects for a healthy, decent and contented life?
To a conscientious believer an insult against religion IS an insult against its adherents, how and why should the two be separated? People feel racially insulted if their culture is insulted, why should it be any different for religious adherents. If the object of Atheist Ireland’s ire is Minister Ahern and the Blasphemy bill, what is there to be gained by deliberately insulting the religious sensibilities of religious adherents?
Perhaps when all is said and done, Mr Dawkins ‘Middle Ages’ caveat, may have a sinister twist, with religious adherents on the receiving end of an atheist inspired persecution of religion. After all, has not ridicule and scorn historically been the precursor of such fiendishness!
Comment by MPACIE — July 14, 2009 @ 12:57 am
No Liam it hasn’t. This has all been well explained to you before. And your repeated attempts to pretend to misunderstand what’s being said to you fools no one. It only serves to remind people of your demagogic instincts. Self interested standards are of no interest to anyone except those who assert them and the self interested individuals who try and conflate themselves with the opinions they hold and then claim these opinions should be given special treatment because adherents did this. What drivel. Mrs Goebells poisened her children because of her “deeply held beliefs”. Believing in crap is believeing in crap. You can believe in crap as passionately as you like. It’s still crap. And just beacause you refrain from calling it such gives you no right to conscript the rest of us to do the same.
Comment by Garlandgreen — July 14, 2009 @ 1:20 am
Quote It is acknowledged that the free dissemination of ideas representing certain communities as inferior or open to gross offence and ridicule
There are some ideas and practices in the Islamic world which deserve nothing But Condemnation
The practice of stong people to death deserves nothing but condemnation
http://drdivas.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/wd.jpg
http://www.darrinhodges.com/2009/06/14/national-australia-bank-nab-to-introduce-sharia-loans/
http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/07_01/stoningDM_468×406.jpg
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-467588/Iranian-wife-faces-death-stoning-adultery.html
the practice of hanging gay people deserves nothing but condemnation
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_qbT9lfmNQI0/SZcFsBbuRTI/AAAAAAAAAvY/Ml8AfXXOMpU/s800/irangayteens1.jpg
http://www.mererhetoric.com/archives/11274175.html
as i pointed out on this thread
http://blasphemy.ie/2009/06/07/artists-to-face-extradition-for-blasphemy/
the issue of girls being married off to older men and FGM deserves nothing but Condemnation
the issue of Religious Police engagng in Honour Killings deserves nothing But Condemnation
http://www.lloyds.com/CmsPhoenix/DowJonesArticle.aspx?id=435154
And theres no law gonna stop me or anyone else from condemming these brutal practices
Comment by Talia — July 14, 2009 @ 1:42 am
I’m sure you have a point in there somewhere Garland, it just gets lost among all the self-inflated hype.
Comment by Mujaahid — July 14, 2009 @ 1:46 am
“Self interested standards are of no interest to anyone except those who assert them and the self interested individuals who try and conflate themselves with the opinions they hold and then claim these opinions should be given special treatment because adherents did this.” That’s Atheist Ireland’s hopes dashed then, eh?
Comment by Mujaahid — July 14, 2009 @ 2:12 am
Comment by MPACIE — July 14, 2009 @ 12:57 am
oh please do fuck off with your moon god puffed up self importance.
you believe in crap. and i have the right to say that.
if you dont like that, fuck off to Saudi Arabia and go live there.
Comment by an atheist — July 14, 2009 @ 10:13 am
Country is being laughed at because of this on a popular american internet forum I’m on.
I can’t believe this law exists…
Comment by Zeouterlimits — July 14, 2009 @ 10:45 am
Zeou: I’d say the lions portion of any foreign ridicule is leveled at ridiculous sites like this that have supposedly mature individuals trying to outdo each other in crass stupidity. You are all quite frankly an embarrassment to Ireland, your infantile level of tantrum-like abuse simply reinforces the stereotype of the gombeen paddy. At least Nugent has an argument of sorts.
Comment by Mujaahid — July 14, 2009 @ 8:42 pm
Not really Muj. Have you seen anyone here suggest that to insult atheism is to insult them or if they do feel insulted by anything you say about the idea should face the law?
Comment by Garlandgreen — July 14, 2009 @ 9:13 pm
So what’s this campaign about then garland? You do come out with some silliness.
Comment by Mujaahid — July 14, 2009 @ 11:06 pm
[...] Dail Passes Blasphemy Law [...]
Pingback by Shared Items – July 15, 2009 – On Matters of Interest — July 15, 2009 @ 6:01 am
It’s about the blasphemy law. It’s mentioned on the top of the page. . And I’ve no concept as to what silliness might mean to someone who seriously believes the assertions of a seventh century peasant claiming that the omnipotent creator of the world spoke to him in a cave and subsequently elsewhere telling him to raid caravans marry a 6 year old, shag her when she’s 9, murder, pillage, raid caravans, have it off with his sons missus as well and then justify it by saying that the deity had ok’d that as well. It’s then be said he ended that wonderful life by making off to heaven on a flying horse no less. If I believed in omnipotent deities I never would have thought of these as the kind of people they hobnobbed with. Maybe this is blasphemy. But how would I know as I would have thought that any right minded person should feel insulted when accused of believing any of this. But people like you might think the opposite. But how are we to know unless we are supposed to know how the mind of someone who believes such stuff works or perhaps more to the point doesn’t
A totalitarian law can be defined as one that never let’s it victims know when it is violating it. Testing it is important because it let’s people know where they stand and so know how to go about defeating it
Comment by Garlandgreen — July 15, 2009 @ 8:31 pm
Now I know you believe your oversimplification and disingenuity sounds ’smart’, but coming from someone who believes we’re all just a result of one huge coincidental mistake … it comes across as special pleading. Not your smartest post garland!
Comment by Mujaahid — July 16, 2009 @ 1:44 am
You want to do something to protest against this stupid law? Put on a 2 day open air film festival showing nothing but sketches and monologues by Dave Allen. That’ll put your point across better than anything!
Comment by Dave S — July 16, 2009 @ 8:01 am
Would you care to show where I special plead? Is anyone here looking for a law to ban you saying what you like about Atheism or Atheists. I don’t need such a law. I’ll deal with you myself. And how could I think that we’re a mistake? Who’s mistake would we be? “Coincidence” suffers a from a similar fallacy. The fact that we exist is coincidental to what exactly? I concede that the last post might not be my smartest comment I’ve ever made but tha’s a rather high bar to be setting for it
Comment by Garlandgreen — July 16, 2009 @ 8:10 pm
Just heard that the President, Mary McAleese has convened the council of state to discuss the bill. This is a constitutional requirement if she is to refer the bill to the supreme court for a decision on whether it is constitutional or not.
This must indicate the “iffy” thiking behind the bill.
However, I wonder if it is the best result for those of us opposed to it, as should the court find it permitted by the constitution, this fireproofs the bill against further constitutional challange.
Perhaps now, we should initiate a campaign to have the opposition parties to promise an immediate reversal of the law should they come to power together with a restoration of the freedom of information act to it’s origional state?
Also, could the fact that Mr. Ahern took an oath before God on appointment as minister, be challanged as blasphemous to those that deny the existance of a god, christian or otherwise?
Comment by Jack Butler — July 17, 2009 @ 6:39 pm
“Comment by Mujaahid — July 16, 2009 @ 1:44 am ”
here’s some cartoons for you
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/56/106096282_8276d346e8_o.jpg
Comment by atheist — July 20, 2009 @ 3:06 pm
As an Irish woman who lives in London, I am embarrassed to know that yet again the Irish Catholic Church is still embedded in Irish Law, even when they have committed the crimes against children etc. Ireland continues to live in this immature mindset because they are so controlled by the religious freaks of our nation. How can we believe in authority who allow nonsense like this to become law. Have they got nothing else to do but to take up time which should be used to serve the poor & working classes of the country. I really thought there was a chance of Ireland maturing but again its backwards we go, I am tired of religious fairytales been peddled to a nation to bring people together in harmony but if you look closely enough underneath the veil of deceit you will find another slice of freedom missing. Big Brother is watching!!!!
Comment by Sharon — July 23, 2009 @ 6:19 pm